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Diptera.info :: Identification queries :: Diptera (adults)
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Biblio marci / hortulanus
Robert Heemskerk
#1 Print Post
Posted on 23-10-2005 12:12
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Hi fly-readers,

Yesterday I saw a group (~50-100) of black flies dancing around a dead tree(Dunes/Holland).
They stood still in the air with the (quite long) legs hanging downward.
I couldn't see any difference in these flies, they all looked quite similar.
The flies were black and the wings were very white. Fly-size ~10mm
It could be a group of (only male!) flies of Biblio marci or Biblio hortulanus, the female flies look more different in these species.
Are there fly-species which look similar to this kind of flies or what kind of fly must I think of?
Biblio m. + h. usualy fly from March and April, it is not the time to fly now?

I made a picture of one fly, not a very good one, but you can see some of it.

best regards, Robert
www.diptera.info/forim/5-0916-1.jpg
Edited by Robert Heemskerk on 23-10-2005 13:53
 
http://robertheemskerk.nl/plaatjevandedag.htm
Andre
#2 Print Post
Posted on 23-10-2005 13:23
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This probably is Dilophus femoratus, a Bibionid flie indeed. It is much smaller than Bibio marci and hortulanus. Definite identification can be made on a collected specimen (ask Theo or Laurens for example).
Greetzz
 
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Mark van Veen
#3 Print Post
Posted on 23-10-2005 15:35
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Op waarneming.nl staat een plaatje van D. femoratus met kenmerken: http://www.waarne...hp?id=6358.

Mogelijk helpt dat. Als je vrouwtjes goed gezien hebt: hadden ze rode dijen? Dat sluit namelijk de gewone koortsvlieg, D. febrilis, uit.

Mark
 
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Robert Heemskerk
#4 Print Post
Posted on 23-10-2005 16:01
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Yes, I think it where Dilophus femoratus or Dilophus febrilis.
I did not see red on the legs, but I did not give attention to this.
Indeed, this flies were to small for Biblio marci / hortulanus!
To be sure I have to visit them again I think...
Maybe I will visit the place again next week.
Thanks a lot for your comment!
 
http://robertheemskerk.nl/plaatjevandedag.htm
Zeegers
#5 Print Post
Posted on 23-10-2005 18:33
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Location: Soest, NL
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Sorry to spoil the party, but I disagree.
There is now way to be sure, but given the picture and the size it is most likely Bibio clavipes (or lepidus).
Arguments: size (too large for Dilophus), longer hairs on thorax and the costa seems to be light near the wing tip (not so in Dilophus).

Where the hack did I find those features:

See link section (my field key to Bibionidae on homepage Louis Boumans, thanks Louis).

Did you collect some specimen ?
Bibio clavipes would be a nice find !


Theo Zeegers
 
Robert Heemskerk
#6 Print Post
Posted on 23-10-2005 23:16
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Ik heb de balonnen en slingers weer opgeruimt hoor!
Drankjes zijn in de koeling teruggezet..,
Als het morgen een beetje weer is ga ik nog een poging wagen en goed op de Bibionidae-kenmerken letten. Nu maar hopen dat ze er nog zitten.
Bedankt voor de zwarte-vliegenlink!, en nog in het Nederlands ook.., dat is fijn.
Smile

groet, Robert Heemskerk

TRANSLATION:
I cleaned up the party decoration!
Drinks are back in the fridge.
If the weather improves tomorrow I will have another go at them and will pay attention to Bibionidae characters. Let's hope they're still there.
Thanks for the March fly link! And in Dutch, too..., that's nice.
Edited by Paul Beuk on 24-10-2005 22:20
 
http://robertheemskerk.nl/plaatjevandedag.htm
Andre
#7 Print Post
Posted on 24-10-2005 00:53
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Nee Robert, dan ook graag een paar v?ngen.. Smile

P.S.: Theo, ontwaar ik daar een doornenkrans om tibia I?

TRANSLATION:
Nr, Robert, you shuld catch a few!

P.S. Theo, are those spines on tibia !?
Edited by Paul Beuk on 24-10-2005 22:21
 
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Robert Heemskerk
#8 Print Post
Posted on 24-10-2005 01:03
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V?ngen!?..Shock..., dan moet ik me eerst verdiepen in wat ze eten en hoe ik ze in leven moet houden!

TRANSLATION:
Catch them!?..Shock.., then I will have to find out what they eat and how to keep them alive!
Edited by Paul Beuk on 24-10-2005 22:22
 
http://robertheemskerk.nl/plaatjevandedag.htm
Zeegers
#9 Print Post
Posted on 24-10-2005 10:32
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Andre is right !
If you look very closely, you can see a row of spines in the middle of tibia 1. Out of focus, but it is there.
This means it is a Dilophus after all.
Three species are candidate: there is no way to tell which it might be.
Unfortunately, since all three have been recorded from the dune area.
The size (about 10 mm.) is most likely somewhat exaggerated.

Theo
 
Robert Heemskerk
#10 Print Post
Posted on 24-10-2005 12:33
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Yes, it look likes spines.
I place a detail of it.
No flies today, to much rain! Sad

Robert
www.diptera.info/forim/5-0916-2.jpg
 
http://robertheemskerk.nl/plaatjevandedag.htm
Paul Beuk
#11 Print Post
Posted on 24-10-2005 13:06
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What you point out here, actually, appear to me as the tips of the tarsal segments...
Paul

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Robert Heemskerk
#12 Print Post
Posted on 24-10-2005 13:39
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Sad mmmm, I think the picture is too bad to see these things and must give up!

Since so far I didn't know anything about such flies, nice species!

Robert,
 
http://robertheemskerk.nl/plaatjevandedag.htm
Andre
#13 Print Post
Posted on 24-10-2005 14:54
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Please catch one Robert... we will kill them for you Wink
 
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Zeegers
#14 Print Post
Posted on 24-10-2005 21:40
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I was talking about the RIGHT frontal leg.
There you can see some structures that may be the Dilophus-spines.

Theo
 
Paul Beuk
#15 Print Post
Posted on 24-10-2005 22:24
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Hey guys, please keep the English up and not switch to Dutch. There are still people how do not understand Dutch (do not ask me why, though Pfft).
Paul

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Andre
#16 Print Post
Posted on 25-10-2005 01:14
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Thank you, dearest Paul, for translating Smile thumbsup!
 
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Paul Beuk
#17 Print Post
Posted on 25-10-2005 08:08
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Andre wrote:
Thank you, dearest Paul, for translating Smile thumbsup!


Wel, you have to take some drastic measures if the non-Dutch speaking members raise there voices (albeit off-line). Pfft
Paul

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Andre
#18 Print Post
Posted on 26-10-2005 11:43
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The weather will be fine tomorrow Robert Pfft
 
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Robert Heemskerk
#19 Print Post
Posted on 26-10-2005 13:36
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Today I tried to get the car, but I could not get it! (I have to borrow it..)
I have to try it tomorrow again.., but that's my father's birthdayShock
And when I find these fly, I try to catch one (I will shut my eyesAngry)
What will happen to this fly?

Could it by useful for scientific study?

regards Robert,
 
http://robertheemskerk.nl/plaatjevandedag.htm
Andre
#20 Print Post
Posted on 27-10-2005 00:18
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If you want, you can bring it to the ZMA, Plantage Middenlaan 64.
Try to catch two or three... Put them in an empty photofilm-box. Write your name on it, the day and place where you caught them too.
Address it to Theo Zeegers and it will get on the right place.
Succes!
Greetings, Andr
 
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