Thread subject: Diptera.info :: What's if it's not the Bertea?
Posted by Thereva on 21-07-2011 12:22
#1
Hi,
in an Italian entomological forum "Forum Entomologi Italiani" it has been posted a photo of a specimen of Diptera Nematocera resting on a wing of Parnassius apollo (Lepidoptera Papilionidae).
http://www.entomologiitaliani.net/public/forum/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?f=11&t=24752
The photo unfortunately is not clear enough.
The fly is apparently brachypterous and a resemblance with the enigmatic
Bertea subaptera Rondani, 1856 has been proposed.
Any suggestion on the identity of the fly?
Posted by Tony Irwin on 21-07-2011 19:53
#2
The fly is a normal male sciarid as far as I can see. It appears to be brachypterous or apterous because its wings are moving too fast for the camera. They do, however, create two dark clouds in the picture.
As for Bertea, I suspect that Rondani's figure actually portrays a parasitic wasp, so it's not surprising that this enimatic fly has not been re-found! ;)
Edited by Tony Irwin on 21-07-2011 20:08
Posted by Hemerobius on 24-07-2011 11:05
#3
Hi,
I'm a Neuropterist with the passion of the historical enigmas in entomology, and
Bertea is one of these. Sorry about my invasion of the dipterist realm.
Tony,
do you really think that Rondani was able to confuse a Diptera with an Hymenoptera? Rondani was a great Dipterist and he described also some Hymenoptera. Moreover the type of
Bertea was saw by Mario Bezzi who stated to be a Sciaridae. Perhaps the judgment of Mario Bezzi is reliable. Do you not think? ;)
Posted by Tony Irwin on 24-07-2011 13:05
#4
Hi Hemerobius
Just looking at the drawing, the legs of
Bertea appear to me much more like those of a wasp than a sciarid, but the quality of the illustration is really not good enough to be sure. I agree that Rondani and Bezzi should both recognise Diptera, and if the type is ever found, I expect it will turn out to be a brachypterous sciarid, but I don't think it will look much like Rondani's figure.
Posted by Hemerobius on 24-07-2011 15:59
#5
You're rights, the Rondani's figure is terrible :S !
Following Bezzi (1913, Bollettino del Laboratorio di zoologia generale e agraria della R. Scuola superiore d'agricoltura in Portici. vol. 7 cfr p. 236) the type was in the box N° 72 of Rondani's collection by "Specola" Museum in Florence, near
Orphnephila devia,
Chionea araneoides,
Blepharocera limbipennis and
Pterelachisus bertei (original names).
I hope to find it.
Posted by jorgemotalmeida on 24-07-2011 16:14
#6
Welcome, Roberto. A nice surprise to see you here.
ps check superegnum flickr for the new neuropter. ;)
Edited by jorgemotalmeida on 24-07-2011 16:15
Posted by Tony Irwin on 24-07-2011 18:21
#7
Good luck with your search for the type! :)
Be sure to let us know if you find it!
Posted by Hemerobius on 27-07-2011 06:30
#8
Found !
But :( only fragments.
Nevertheless the leg appear to belong to a Diptera.
Ciao :)
Posted by jorgemotalmeida on 27-07-2011 11:09
#9
this shows that cryopreservation should be choosed as being one of the best way to protect the specimens! I use this method now and it is very good. Also it protects against the light.
It seems the specimen was attacked by fungi? (in very low temperatures the specimen would be preserved and without oxidation as well, and avoid larvae attack of Anthrenus!). I do not see even the halteres.
Edited by jorgemotalmeida on 27-07-2011 11:33
Posted by Tony Irwin on 27-07-2011 11:10
#10
Congratulations!
Agreed, Diptera, possibly Sciaridae.
(Might have been better if the
Anthrenus had finshed it off! ;))