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Diptera.info :: Family forums :: Asilidae Forum
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Bulgarian Stenopogon
clovis
#1 Print Post
Posted on 23-03-2014 17:31
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Location: North France, lille
Posts: 908
Joined: 08.06.10

Hi,

Here is a Stenopogon i found this summer on bulgarian black sea side.
Using this paper and some other things i stay with 2 possibility: S sabaudus and S.xanthotrichus (and macilentus).
S xanthotrichus look really similar with its black femora.

Do you know how to differentiate those 2?

www.galerie-insecte.org/galerie/image/dos116/big/kitten_juillet_2.jpg
Clovis : Bulgarie : Kiten : 8183 : 7/7/2013
Altitude : 5 m - Taille : 18 mm
Réf. : 116495
www.galerie-insecte.org/galerie/image/dos116/big/kitten_juillet_2h.jpg
Clovis : Bulgarie : Kiten : 8183 : 7/7/2013
Altitude : 5 m - Taille : 18 mm
Réf. : 116496
 
Quaedfliegh
#2 Print Post
Posted on 24-03-2014 01:57
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Location: Tilburg Netherlands
Posts: 2198
Joined: 18.05.10

With key by Engel i get S. sabaudus fulvulus. This name is not valid though. Maybe a thermophilic variety of sabaudus? It is also possible i miss something. I hope someone else reacts too.
Greetings,

Reinoud

Field guide to the robber flies of the Netherlands and Belgium: https://www.jeugdbondsuitgeverij.nl/product/field-guide-to-the-robberflies-of-the-netherlands-and-belgium/

https://www.nev.nl/diptera/
 
Mariastraat 12
clovis
#3 Print Post
Posted on 24-03-2014 12:09
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Location: North France, lille
Posts: 908
Joined: 08.06.10

Hope too also, but many thanks still for those informations Smile
With this key you can rule out xanthotrichus?

On the net, i only found this: "sabaudus fulvulus Pallas in Wiede-
mann (1818) [ = occultus Loew (1861), pyrrhomus
Wiedemann (1818), pyrrhous Schiner (1862)]" here.
I don't know if that can help. (xanthotrichus been described in 1832)
 
Quaedfliegh
#4 Print Post
Posted on 27-03-2014 22:16
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Location: Tilburg Netherlands
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: ) That xanthotrichus description fits reasonably good too. As i can't see some characters on these pictures i have to gamble. I would like to have a clear picture of the wing venation and belly of abdomen. But desription of both xanthotrichus and sabaudus say that the sides of the tergites have to be shiny black and not dusted. This is not the case here. Maybe someone else has a better opinion.
Greetings,

Reinoud

Field guide to the robber flies of the Netherlands and Belgium: https://www.jeugdbondsuitgeverij.nl/product/field-guide-to-the-robberflies-of-the-netherlands-and-belgium/

https://www.nev.nl/diptera/
 
Mariastraat 12
clovis
#5 Print Post
Posted on 31-03-2014 18:14
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Location: North France, lille
Posts: 908
Joined: 08.06.10

Here it is Smile:
nsa33.casimages.com/img/2014/03/31/140331071848382239.jpg
nsa33.casimages.com/img/2014/03/31/14033107191217677.jpg

Strangly the shiny black side of tergite is well visible here.
i can't tell you it's the same specimen, i collected a few of them from this place. But if it isn't, it must be his brother Smile
 
Quaedfliegh
#6 Print Post
Posted on 04-04-2014 22:16
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The sternites seem to be red, so according to Engel that would exclude xanthotrichus?? But new pictures of the genitalia and the hind legs might bring a solution....: )
Edited by Quaedfliegh on 09-04-2014 00:07
Greetings,

Reinoud

Field guide to the robber flies of the Netherlands and Belgium: https://www.jeugdbondsuitgeverij.nl/product/field-guide-to-the-robberflies-of-the-netherlands-and-belgium/

https://www.nev.nl/diptera/
 
Mariastraat 12
clovis
#7 Print Post
Posted on 08-04-2014 19:32
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Location: North France, lille
Posts: 908
Joined: 08.06.10

The hind leg:
nsa33.casimages.com/img/2014/04/08/140408083723470499.jpg

And part of the genitalia (not really good)
But I'm not sure whereas it's the part you are looking for or not...
nsa34.casimages.com/img/2014/04/08/140408083802508234.jpg
 
Quaedfliegh
#8 Print Post
Posted on 13-04-2014 23:18
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Location: Tilburg Netherlands
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Picture is good enough, but this is the dorsal view? Could you make a picture of the ventral side?
Greetings,

Reinoud

Field guide to the robber flies of the Netherlands and Belgium: https://www.jeugdbondsuitgeverij.nl/product/field-guide-to-the-robberflies-of-the-netherlands-and-belgium/

https://www.nev.nl/diptera/
 
Mariastraat 12
clovis
#9 Print Post
Posted on 19-04-2014 15:32
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Location: North France, lille
Posts: 908
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Yes, dorsal view.
Here is the ventral view. Couldn't make better, but if you can't see what you need and you have some drawing, please share, i see much better than those photos under binocular. Wink

nsa34.casimages.com/img/2014/04/19/140419043704567175.jpg
nsa33.casimages.com/img/2014/04/19/140419044004589327.jpg

Sorry for the delay, i don't really have much time right now, but many thanks for your research Smile
 
Quaedfliegh
#10 Print Post
Posted on 24-04-2014 22:29
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Location: Tilburg Netherlands
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An important character is the shape of the hypandrium (9th sternite) it seems to be simple triangular but i cant be sure because i cant see if there are lateral projections a bit sharper : ) ? . In Richter 1988 there are some drawings. We can see that the sternites are red which should exclude S. xanthotrichus.
Quaedfliegh attached the following image:


[148.33Kb]
Edited by Quaedfliegh on 24-04-2014 22:31
Greetings,

Reinoud

Field guide to the robber flies of the Netherlands and Belgium: https://www.jeugdbondsuitgeverij.nl/product/field-guide-to-the-robberflies-of-the-netherlands-and-belgium/

https://www.nev.nl/diptera/
 
Mariastraat 12
clovis
#11 Print Post
Posted on 26-04-2014 16:44
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Location: North France, lille
Posts: 908
Joined: 08.06.10

S9 is exactly consistent with fig 6 (and fig1).
Sternites are all red with lateral margin black.

So do you think all this description correspond to S sabaudus?
Edited by clovis on 26-04-2014 16:46
 
Quaedfliegh
#12 Print Post
Posted on 27-04-2014 14:28
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Location: Tilburg Netherlands
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I think so, yes, but t differs a bit colour, local variety?
Greetings,

Reinoud

Field guide to the robber flies of the Netherlands and Belgium: https://www.jeugdbondsuitgeverij.nl/product/field-guide-to-the-robberflies-of-the-netherlands-and-belgium/

https://www.nev.nl/diptera/
 
Mariastraat 12
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